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Thread: Coloured shading

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Surrey, BC, Canada
    Posts
    221

    Coloured shading

    After a couple weeks in the mist beds, my clematis cuttings this year are the best ever. No duds that I can see, which is quite an improvement for me.

    I wanted to share, for what it's worth, a trial I'm doing with blue shade on my propagation tunnel.

    An article in the IPPS journal a few years ago (International Plant Propagation Society) compared some experiments rooting stuff under white poly, regular black shade cloth, and various colours of shade spray painted onto poly overtop the mist area. The results were surprising.

    The poorest rooting occured under the white poly, which is what I've used for a couple years...just regular overwintering white poly. Significant improvements came by spray painting over clear poly. What really intrigued me was the example of blue painted poly, which not only gave excellent rooting, but had absolutely no disease incidence. This sounded exciting to somebody like me rooting the disease prone clematis.

    Well its only been a couple weeks, but my crazy looking blue plastic tunnel is giving me very quick rooting, with no disease so far...even on the cuttings with leaves I accidentally damaged while preparing them.

    Buying a quart of blue latex paint could be the best investment in disease management, as well as rooting of cuttings, that I've done! The next month should be interesting, as that's about how long these babies should take before potting up starts.

    Glen

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Bolton, Ont
    Posts
    149

    Blue Paint

    Glen sounds pretty wierd and confusing. I havent thought about using a tunnel on my mist bet yet. Right now the kids are using it as a sand box. Im kinda thinking what I can put in it that will root.

    HEY! when I get a tunnel Ill try to root some Taxus. This winter was not good except the Hills yew. Everything else either didnt root or rotted.

    You mentioned that you had good success of cuttings not rotting.
    The colour thing is pretty wierd but if it works hey who cares.

    Glen have you tried using shade cloth, or is the poly/ paint technique better. I maybe the only nursery around here that has blue poly. Ill try to remember to make a copy of your initial message.
    If I forget Ill remember who ask.

    Any advise is certainly appreciated. Hope to have my misting on soon. George.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Surrey, BC, Canada
    Posts
    221

    Shade

    George--yes the blue paint would be the shading. Shade cloth is the normal thing people use on their prop houses during summer. I have never had any of that stuff, so I just built my little poly tunnels using the overwintering (70% shading) white poly, throwing it away each year after the sun's been on it all summer.

    If you are propagating inside a hoop house, you could still make tunnels inside the hoop house, and paint those. I might not want to permanently colour my whole hoop house if I was you...unless this turns out so good you can be rooting stuff year round in there and making a bundle that way!

    One thing I found out real quick was, to spray on the watered down blue latex paint, you have to lay your poly out on the ground, flat, and go back and forth a few times till the drops of paint just strart to all touch each other. That will give good shading and colouring of the cuttings. Try spraying the poly when it's still on the hoops, and you get some real interesting blue zebra stripes, yikes!

    George, do you usually shade your taxus cuttings? They are done thru the winter, so not much sun then anyway, plus it's plenty cool and lots of humidity, right?

    I did try winter rooting once, doing rhodos and arctostaphylos with bottom heat. I'm pretty sure the white poly was too dark for those things, they really took off when I changed over to clear, and just threw some row cover (Remay type stuff) across to take the harshness of direct sunlight away. And no mist needed during winters here, the structure was always dripping wet in there, since the bottom heat is always driving moisture up into the air from the rooting media.

    That's too bad about last winter's cutting crop, what a drag doing lots and lots of cuttings like I know you do, and then having a crop failure. It's bad enough when it's just a flat or two like most of us hobby gardeners will often do, but days and days of sticking cuttings is hard to take!

    Taxus was one plant a wholesaler just pointed me to the other day, said they are really hot sellers right now, esp. the hicks (like always, right? Hicks has always seemed the most common one done here).

    Well, hopefully better things coming, hope the weather cooperates for all you easterners, at least!

    Glen

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Bolton, Ont
    Posts
    149
    Glen I dont use shadecloth for my cuttings as their done indoors under grow lights.

    I just removed all my cuttings from the flats and placed in a corner of the greenhose, More shade cuz of the wood that covers the ends.

    I wasnt happy from the results. I usually get 90% success. This time I got maybe 75%. 15% doesnt seem much but after a lot of cuttings it does add up.

    We now do 300-400 cuttings of one specie. This way all our varieties are being stocked. I would like to overgrow HILLS Yew. No need for unnessesary watering, trans planting feeding etc. We grow with the flow of the sales.

    Taxus Yews are certainly not cheap.

    You mentioned that someone showed you some Hicks Yew. I find the Hills Yew a much better yew. More compact, Darker green, and better shaped. The Hills Yew looks like a young Norway Spruce, Dark green, tight needles etc.

    The varieties that I like are the Hills Yew of course, Gold Yew, Globe Yew. And the Japanese Yew Clipped Cone. The one that I havent found any such way how to grow it. There are a lot of ways to grow it. I need a way that works, except by cuttings. Ive done that and they grow into a terrible shaped plant. I emptied a whole corner pot after pot of these yews. Less watering and less use of my time.
    I like them all, but my best are the Japanese Yew clipped cone, Hills Yew

    Glen the varieties resently potted up are the Globe, Gold, Hills, Hicks. Brows Yew that hardly rooted if any. They werent worth potting up.

    Im going to start setting up my misting this week.

    I have to find out how to post pictures on here.
    Till next time Take care. George.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Surrey, BC, Canada
    Posts
    221

    Red light

    Don't know if anybody is following my experiments with the blue shading on the mist beds, but I need to follow up a bit!

    After a nice start, having the clematis callus up quickly with no botrytis problems, I have looked at these babies for over 2 months now waiting for them to push out roots. Virtually nothing...what a shock.

    It's a detective job now trying to figure out what went wrong. Some possibilities:
    --I bumped up the bottom heat from just under 20C previously, to the mid 20's for a while this season...backed off that now coz it was burning the bottom ends of some stems. Moderation in all things...a bit more heat might speed things up, but clematis never like root temps of 27C or higher even as adult plants.

    --I added mycorrhizal innoculum to the cuttings stems before sticking. This has been very beneficial to some plants, like camellias, that tend to get "stuck" in the callus stage without pushing roots. Talked to the "expert" in this area, Mike Amaranthus, who commented they've never seen rooting depressed by myco in the 28 years they've been dealing with it.

    --my tunnels are totally covered with the plastic, which was spray painted. Some research on the net suggests that plants need a bit of red light to get roots going...have I stopped the rooting by giving them 100% blue light? The original expt that I read about used a coloured screen suspended over the cutting area, so it actually wouldn't give a complete, 100% colour shift, just a majority of the light. Hmmm...

    --Finally, my setup this spring gave quite bright conditions, actually much brighter than I have been using (the overwintering poly was 70% white shade...successful in rooting but a bit of overkill I still think...most growers seem to aim for about 40% shade for most plants). Could the cuttings be recovering from the stress of too little shade for my admittedly low level of misting...I'm used to running the mist like every 15-30 mins (7 sec. blast) depending on the day's weather.

    Overall, I just wanted to caution anybody from running out and jumping into this shading thing based on my initial "success". Got definite bugs to work out of this thing.

    I will keep trying to do something with the colours, tho, coz the clematis are very susceptible to botrytis and some other leaf disease in the mist...and I simply haven't had any of that this season under the blue colouring. It's worth the the trouble for me, to see if I can adapt something to at least control disease, along with as good if not better rooting.

    The saga continues...

    Glen

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    SE PA, zone 6b
    Posts
    217

    Fungus Among Us

    At the PANTS show, and later ,when I read the catalogs carefully, I noticed that many vendors were selling various concoctions containing a bacterium that stops the funguses in thier tracks. Read through the Insecticide part of the catalog and you will find two-four fungicides that contain this bacti.

    I will be going to Griffin's next week and get some dry to mix with my potting soil, and some wet to spray. I used 1 tbs baking soda to 1gal of water this week to stop some problem areas. I'll report later on its effectiveness.

    This seems, for me anyway, easier than taking on the world over my blue greenhouse! But, having said that, Glen, I really appreciate your experiments and reporting of same. You live in rot heaven, to which I would move in a heartbeat if I could. How I miss the mountains!!!
    Sandi
    SE PA, zone 6b

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Surrey, BC, Canada
    Posts
    221

    Fungus

    Sandi--I think we all run into fungus one way or other. In the mist beds, it's always a threat...

    I've avoided fungicides almost entirely myself...tried hydrogen peroxide, compost tea, and now blue shade on the mist area poly tunnel. Looks like there is some advantage to each.

    In Canada, we have lost the use of many pesticides recently...benomyl, diazinon, all the old systemics have all been deregistered for retail sale. I'm happy with it, even tho it's a political type decision, not an environmental one in this case.

    I will find a way to farm without poisons somehow!

    As for rot heaven, this summer seems to have been a switch for both of us, according to shepp anyway, you've got the cool, wetter stuff? Nothing but hot and sunny this spring and summer on the west coast...I'll be ready for fall this year!

    Glen

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