STOP! Don't throw away those Daylily Scapes--there are babies in there! [Archive] - Landspro

Shari of SC

06-21-2002, 06:28 AM

I have made the most interesting discovery this week and I'm so excited that I just have to share it. Now, if you don't like daylilies (http://www.daylilies.org) and care even less about how to get more baby ones; then just traipse on over to another thread 'cause this one is not for you. However if you love daylilies, especially very unusual and pretty ones; (http://kricri.com/index.shtml) and want to increase their population more easily than ever before, you're in the right place. Pull up a chair, get yourself a glass of lemonade and stay for awhile. I'm going to talk about daylilies and I guarantee this will be interesting.

Did you ever notice that some of the prettiest daylilies are often the ones that multiply poorly. Well, this is true of my garden anyway. The common, naturalized orange ones are everywhere. Folks around here unlovingly refer to them as
"ditch lilies" (http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/fulvous.html) because they multiply like weeds and are seen along roadsides everywhere. They defy all garden pests and lawn mowers. Throw them into the compost pile and they happily take up residence there. However the pretty ones, though easy to grow, are usually not as promiscuous as their wild sisters.

Daylilies are most often propagated by seeds (http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/seed.html), division of the clumps (http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/division.html), and proliferations. (http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/proliferation.html) Since seedlings are usually not exact replicas of the mother plant, and divisions disrupt blooms and clump appearance; the method I prefer is proliferations.
When I first began growing fancy daylilies, I noticed these little plantlets attached to the scapes (http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/scape.html) usually grew only when accompanied by a seedpod. It seemed that the presence of a seedpod caused the mother plant to maintain the scape long enough for the proliferation to develop. Scapes without seedpods quickly withered and turned brown after the last bloom folded. Hmmm--no rocket science is needed here to realize that if I want proliferations I need those seedpods---even if I have to run around garden every morning making buzzing bee noises as I dutifully apply pollen to pistils. (http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/ImageMap.html)

*When propagating any plant be sure that it is not a variety protected by a plant patent. (http://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/syllabi/315/PlantPatent.html)

And now on to my discovery---
The early-season, fancy daylilies have finished their first wave of blooms, set seedpods and are beginning to send up new fans from which the second wave of blooms will come. That means clean-up and maintenance time. I removed all dead and bad looking foliage and scapes, checked for insects and disease, generously fed each clump with liquid fertilizer, then loaded all the debris into the compost bin.

As I moved on to the next task, I was still thinking of those dying daylily scapes with no seedpods and no proliferations. There were more than usual this year. I recalled the normal pithy inside of the scapes and it reminded me of the sugar cane I "helped" my grandfather plant as a child. He'd always point out the "eye's" at each joint and say "There's babies in there just waitin' to grow." --------- What if ?????? ------------

I rushed to the compost bin, quickly retrieved those pitiful scapes and looked at them a little closer. Sure enough -- "eye's".
I cut all of those scapes into sections, so that each one had an "eye" in the middle leaving as much of the scape as possible on each end. Plants must have light and water to grow, so I put the sections in a clear plastic container large enough for them to lay sideways, and covered them with water. Next I put the container full of soaking scape sections in window that gets very bright light but no direct sun rays. After 24 hours, I changed the water and pulled away the loose material from the scapes. The "eye's" were swelling. The following day I changed the water again--the eye's had now become little green buds.

It is now day five. The 43 the buds are about ½ an inch long and growing daily. There were babies in there just waiting to grow.

Thanks for the daylilies Granddad.

Shari

jimtx

06-21-2002, 05:35 PM

Ok Shari .. I am a lover of daylilies and have quiet a few .. but have no idea what are scapes .... know what the seed pod is .. and harvest seeds but need a little help on the term "scapes". I also don't worry a lot about names ..so won't be able to identify what I have. Have a few ditch lilies but also a lot of different ones ... some rebloomers and some doubles (maybe that is what they are called ... looks like two flowers on top of each other)

Next to old roses .. these are our favorites ....

So many plants .. so little room ....

Jim

Shari of SC

06-21-2002, 05:37 PM

Jim the underlined words are hyperlinks---click on it and you will see. Surprise!
:)
Shari

Ray

06-22-2002, 07:15 AM

Shari,

I have scapes too!! I walked outside and found what you wrote about. Thank you!!! Thank you!!! Thank you!!!

I'll be making more day lillies for next year. Thanks again,

Gene

06-22-2002, 09:24 AM

I have scapes also but mine aren't green there deader the a doornail do you think theres enough juice in there to wake up the babys

Shari of SC

06-22-2002, 09:38 AM

Now you know to set seedpods.:D

However; it may not be to late. Pull off the scape with a quick jerk all the way down at the base of the plant. You just may be surprised to find a little green and an eye left near the bottom. It is worth a try. They are quite dead looking any way and need to come off, right? So why not give it a try. I hope you will be pleasantly surprised.

:) I had one lady tell me that she went out to the garden center and bought a bloomed out one (at a discount no less) with scapes left on it so that she could try this.

Shari

Gene

06-22-2002, 09:52 AM

Shari
I have never cleaned out the scapes I just let them be I guess they eventaully just fall off and than I'll mow them up .I have them planted ibn the back to keep the soil from washing down hill. But will give it a try just to see for myself. Who knows I might start collecting daylillys

Shari of SC

06-22-2002, 10:06 AM

Gene,
Click on the link on my post at the beginning of this thread (where it says:-- very unusual and pretty ones; ) It takes you to a french website that displays over 8,000 pictures of very ornate and and colorful named daylily cultivars indexed from A-Z. The words are French, (of which I speak very little) but the pictures are gorgeous.

Those are definitely not "ditch-lilies".

Shari

Gene

06-22-2002, 03:27 PM

Very nice web site Shari I didn't know there was so many different lillys out there

Shari of SC

06-25-2002, 01:01 PM

:) :) Excuse the quality--I'm learning to use this camera but thought you'd like to see them before I plant this last group.

Shari

Shari of SC

06-25-2002, 01:31 PM

Day 10

Shari of SC

06-25-2002, 01:40 PM

Day 10 as well

Shari of SC

06-25-2002, 01:42 PM

Still day 10
Notice that section 1 and 4 have multiple bud growths, and section 2 has a root just beginning to protrude at the base of the bud.

Now they get planted with their siblings.

JORD729

06-25-2002, 02:48 PM

Hi All!! I hope it's O.K. to just jump in!

Thanks Shari!! Good to know what to be looking for!!

LISA

Ann B.

06-25-2002, 03:02 PM

Hi, Lisa!

It's wonderful to have you jump in....

It's exciting to see so many visitors, and even more so when you join.

Welcome to Landspro and thanks for becoming a member. We sincerely hope you will be jumping in a lot.

Ros H

06-25-2002, 04:17 PM

I had to read your original post a couple of times to be sure I understood. The photos were a BIG help . . .

My mom said that explains why a bush hog can mow them down in full bloom and the plants will reappear down or on the other side of the road. She had always wondered about that

Guess I know what I'll be doing this afternoon . . .

Ros

Shari of SC

06-25-2002, 05:24 PM

Of course there's a little more to it---I thought you people would never ask!!:) :)

I've just posted the following answer to a question on another board. Since I also posted my "discovery" there we've been chatting about this for several days.

The question was:
And there was absolutely nothing there when you started them??

My Answer:
Smooth, mature but dying scapes.
There was the appearance of a speck of latent bud at the bract.
Day four-- you should be seeing some bud action there.
By day 5 here, there were obvious little plantlets pushing through and I took them out of the water bath.
I put them into zipper top plastic bags, sprayed each with a diluted solution of root & bloom booster and blew up the bag to give them some CO2. --- And waited impatiently.

I opened the bag daily because I was curious; but also sprayed to keep them moist and replaced the air (?breath of life perhaps?).

Bob, I'm not sure if it will work with "ditch lilies". I don't know that I've ever seen a proliferation on one. They multiply so fast anyway that all you have to do is dig up a shovel full of them and plant them anywhere. They'll grow and multiply; then if you give some away they sneak back home at night.

:) I'm very sure that the scapes have to be somewhat green for the for the latent bud to still have life.

Basically its the fancy, named, e-x-p-e-n-s-i-v-e ones that everyone wants more of. I just coaxed some buds out of a latent state and encouraged them to grow.

Happy Gardening,
Shari

Ros H

06-26-2002, 07:33 AM

I've got some "ditch lily" equivalents in my garden. One bract near the bottom of a scape had a 1" baby growing out of it. I tired to get a photo, but alas, the batteries in my camera were quite dead. It was quite a discovery.

Glad you wrote that last post Shari - I'm taking that one out of the water and putting it in a bag.

Another question . . . at what point do you plant them?

Ros

Shari of SC

06-26-2002, 03:15 PM

Ros,
I would plant them just as soon as the plantlet appears to be sturdy enough. It probably should be out of the bud stage and have visible leaflets. It is important not to wait until the stem deteriorates and begins to decay or the plant will die.

Be sure to use only damp, sterile potting mix or vermiculite. You will need to first apply a rooting hormone to the base of the plantlet where the roots will be growing. Either the powdered type or the dip type will work. After applying the rooting hormone gently push the plantlet into the soil.

Once planted, keep it damp but not wet just as you would any seedling. Do not let it dry out.

I'm sure there are other methods that will work as well or better. Just use your instincts and what you know about plant development and survival and go for it.

Shari

Shari of SC

06-27-2002, 06:41 PM

The following question was just asked on the other board.

"......Is it absolutely necessary to cover these scapes entirely with water?" --

My Answer:
I do not know the answer to that question. The deductive logic I used in my experiment was as follows:

Like humans and all other life forms, plants produce chemicals (we might call them hormones) that control life, growth, reproduction, etc. We know that some daylilies have the ability to reproduce themselves in various ways i.e. seeds, root divisions, and oddly enough by proliferations.

I have observed that the reproductive cycle with daylilies occurs in a very orderly fashion. First the maturity of the plant, then the bloom, then the seed, then the proliferation and finally the root division.

When the seed pod is gone, the plant seems to stop sending chemical messages to the scape and the scape dies. I am assuming that when I retrieved the mature but dying scapes, I caught them while they still contained some of the "make-a-proliferation" chemical.

As a result, I was able to maintain the section of scape long enough for the bud to develop. The timing seems to me to be essential.

As for which medium and which method to use, try several ways...If we all continue to experiment, who knows what great and interesting discoveries we will make.

Good Luck!
Shari

Shari of SC

06-29-2002, 08:27 AM

I didn't have the heart to put these last little ones out into the cruel world of bugs and critters yet. :)

Shari

June29

Ann B.

06-29-2002, 08:36 AM

Thanks, Shari!

This is so much fun...

I am trying your method now, and your picture reminds me that I'd better go take a look at them!

Keep up the GOOD WORK!

:cool:

Steve Wheat

06-29-2002, 10:05 PM

Thankyou Shari

I have just went crazy over daylilies. I started my collection last year and now have over 130 varieties. I just read your post , and I am so so excited..I will be up early in the morning to check my scrapes to see what I might salvage, most have already bloomed. I have been hybridizing also this year and have several seed pods , but I did notice that several plants did not(and I remember pollinating those). Now I may have a new way to grow daylilies

thanks so much
steve :D

Ros H

07-01-2002, 01:14 PM

The photo is not the greatest, but I thought you'd get a kick out of my "find" while cutting scapes:

Ann B.

07-03-2002, 03:42 PM

Lilium are another type of plant that has what is known as a proliferation. The proliferations in the leaf axils of liliums are called bubils.

For more information on Lilium propagation and bulbils refer to the following thread (click on the underlined words):

Lilium and/or Tiger Lily Propagation (http://www.landspro.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=&postid=2794#post2794)

I would like to invite the guest of Landscape Propagation (http://www.landspro.com/page1.htm) to browse the Landspro Message Board (http://www.landspro.com/forums) topics. You do not have to be a member to view the posts or search the board for specific information.

Should you decide to join, you can subscribe to any thread on this forum by clicking on 'Recieve Updates to this thread' located at the bottom of each thread. By subscribing to a post, you will receive email notification when the thread is updated. As a member, you can also post replies to the thread.

Note: When you are finished with any link on the forum, be sure to close your browser window to return to this forum.

Welcome to Landspro, and I hope you enjoy your visit with us!

Janene Tidwell

07-08-2002, 11:02 AM

Shari, I am having so much fun making daylily babies. Thanks so much for your information. I do have several questions and would appreciate you e-mailing me. I just registered for the landspro forum and have sooo much to learn.
Janene Tidwell

Forgiven

07-09-2002, 06:57 PM

Shari,

My 16 year old daughter is going to absolutely love this. She loves lilies and just wait until she hears this wonderful way to make babies! This may just be the thing to encourage her to get involved in the garden.

I have a few lilies that I planted last year. They have multiplied some this year. The first wave of blooms are about done, so it is just in time.

What a wonderful find. I thank you and your grandpa too!

Shari of SC

07-10-2002, 04:33 PM

I have just made the following post to the daylily forum and thought it might be of interest to some folks here as well:

"Thank you all for your contributions and input into this project. Many of us have learned much about proliferations as a method of increasing daylilies.

Lisa generously shares her photos and experiences as they occur.

Mia shared her knowledge of chemical growth stimulants and gave us great information on producing more proliferations on each scape.

Judy Ann shared her secret of using clay pots to protect baby plants once they’re in the garden; and also her discovery of thriving buds that were tossed into shaded, damp spot in the garden while she was unable to attend them.

Crystal shared information of her safe, broad spectrum ant microbial (GSE) so that we can eliminate the bacteria factor.

Laurie in Texas shared her observance of proliferations on hostas and a possibility that this method might work with them as well.

Numerous others offer method tips, encouragement and interest as the saga continues to unfold.

Again, thank you for all the wonderful input.

I’ve had many of questions regarding when to plant the buds.

I planted each one either when it seemed mature enough to survive without the scape; or when the scape seriously deteriorated and the plantlet would have died.

Before I planted them, I cut away the remaining scape and coated the base of the plantlet with powdered rooting hormone. I'm sure the liquid "dip" type would also work.
After planting it is important to keep it in a cool, humid environment until the roots develop and the plant can sustain itself.

Some of the buds didn't survive after they were planted.

Some factors that will negatively affect the survival:
* Scapes submersed in water too long
* Too much heat
* Bacteria
* Lack of humidity

Of the 43 original buds generated in this experiment, 28 still survive many of which are thriving.

Shari

Ann B.

07-11-2002, 08:26 AM

Shari and All,

I have started a new topic on flower bed design. The first post contains pictures of a new and unique daylily flower bed at our local botanical gardens that I thought would be of interest to you.

You can view this thread by clicking on the following link:

Flower Bed Design (http://www.landspro.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=586)

Feel free to browse, and if you are a member of Landspro, we are looking forward to hearing about your thoughts and ideas.

Enjoy!

Janene Tidwell

07-12-2002, 12:17 PM

Shari, I have a queston--as usual. OK, I have kept the scapes in the water and now 3 days in the zip lock bag. Several of the babies were ready to plant and I did that. What do I do with the babies that look like small English Peas? Keep them in the bag or put them back in water or plant?
One of the large babies I planted started turning yellow so I took it out of the dirt and put it back in water.By the way,when I planted my babies I left about an inch of the scape on top and a very small portion on the bottom. This is the way I have always done flips when I rooted them.Of course, the flips had roots. I think the baby may still get some nourishment from the scape. They have been nice and green. Please let me know what you think about the English Peas?
Janene

Shari of SC

07-12-2002, 01:14 PM

Janene,

If the scape is healthy, I'd hold off on planting them just yet. However, if the scape is deteriorating, you'll need to cut away the deteriorating part and try to save the bud by whatever means possible.

I would also make sure that they are not exposed to excessive heat. In two controlled groups, my slow growers responded better at every stage of development on a bright window sill (no direct sun) in an air-conditioned environment.

When I try the next group, I want to experiment with GSE or another anti-microbial to reduce the bacteria level and hopefully allow less intensive attention to the developing buds and plantlets.

Shari

Forgiven

07-12-2002, 10:32 PM

Shari,

You have me looking at every lily I see. Even along the road. I was sitting at a stop sign today at lunch. And right beside the car was a patch of lilies. I could see the babies from my car!

I wanted to jump out and grab a few, but knew it would not be kind to the gardener.

I cannot believe they jump out at you once you know to look.

Again, I am amazed!

Ros H

07-14-2002, 12:12 PM

This is an update of the earlier scape I posted. Does the weight of the thing eventually pull it to the ground where it roots? I've got four (of about ten) that made it through the budding process. Any recommendations on this one or just continue to leave it as is?

Also, Shari, do you use the GSE for any other plant applications? I love the stuff for medicinal use.

Shari of SC

07-14-2002, 03:51 PM

If the scape survives long enough, the prolif will form roots right where it is, especially if it gets abundant moisture from sprinklers or frequent rains. (However, too much water can cause nasty crown rot to the mother plant when the soil is high in humus material.)

I prefer to let mama daylily care for her offspring as long as she is willing to do so. When the scape begins to die back (usually when the seedpod is gone), I cut it back to the top of the prolif. If the scape continiues to turn yellow beneath the prolif, I usually rescue the prolif and plant it next to it's mama (if it is large enough and has some roots). After planting, I keep it moist and shaded until the roots are established.

If the weather is unusually hot and dry, or if it the prolif hasn't developed roots when it's taken from the scape, I plant it in a pot and place it in a shaded spot.

I've begun using GSE with all plants as a seed wash (soak) prior to attempting to germinate them; and also as a soak for all cuttings before dusting with rooting hormone and sticking them down. I'm also experimenting with some other plant related applications.

Shari

Ann B.

07-21-2002, 04:51 PM

Hi!

I found this site while browsing the web today, and I think it would be of interest to see pictures and read about the different stages of tissue culture for daylilies. It's quite an informative page with lots of pictures and brief explanations of the process.

Click on the link below:

Daylily Tissue Culture (http://daylily.net/heavenlygardens/tissue_culture.htm)

Enjoy!

sunrisegirl

08-04-2002, 11:05 AM

Is it possible to make "babies" from iris scapes or is this technique just limited to daylilies? I've started some daylily scapes in a baggie with soil about 3-4 weeks ago..this was a very inspiring post for me. Thanks to all!

Ann B.

08-06-2002, 12:52 PM

Bobbie,

I have researched the idea of propagating iris scapes, but I have been unable to find any information on the subject.

That does not mean that it is not possible. It just means that it is not the propagation method that is normally used for iris. It certainly sounds like an idea worth trying, though. It's always fun to try new methods.

Let us know what happens if you do!

Rebecca

08-22-2002, 09:47 AM

I have read this string with great interest and I thank you for beginning it! What marvolus information! However, I have had several of my daylilies produce proliferations on scapes that DID NOT carry a seed pod. I would have to say, therefore, that the presence of the seed pod is not necessarily a sign that a proliferation is possible! I gathered a dozen or more prolifs off of the daylily plants at a local discount chain, none had seed pods and some plants produced prolifs on more than one scape! Nealy all of these plants were the same cross. Next year I will begin my search sooner! (First there has to be something other than Stella D'Oro and Happy Returns!)

There are a couple of public display plants I am ging to have to check out! I've been watching the for open pollinated seed pods to develope, but now I must take a closer look and see if any prolifs or even possibilities of prolifs are there.

You've started something that I see no end to! Thank you! :D

Oceanics

09-03-2002, 09:45 PM

Shari. that French site matter of fact is in Quebec not in France and as you can see very well done. And buy the way thanks, to you and your Grandfather

Oceanics

ldymacearle

09-24-2002, 07:09 PM

I'm so very new to "scapes"...so bare with me please. Am I to understand you put them into bags with water? Were they totally submerged? .....and when you planted them in soil...how much of the ??stem ?branch?? was planted?

goldeneagle

09-25-2002, 12:34 AM

Hi everyone -

I have read all of the old entries that you all have made concerning DAYLILIES - and just really enjoyed all the terms and locations to see the different ones -

All I have right now or about 8 (ditch lilies) orange with black spots - but when they die I have not found anything on them to carry babies - the whole stalk turns brown and dried looking and then nothing is left - till they come back next year -- but will start looking before they turn brown and maybe I will be able to have more of these gorgeous plants -

Anyway just wanted to say - thanks for all the great information -

Shari of SC

09-25-2002, 10:16 AM

ldymacearle,

In Daylily language “scape” equals bloom stalk. Under the right conditions (high humidity is one factor), Daylilies will produce new plants along the scape at the leaf bracts, and sometimes at the very top of the scape among the top flower buds. These small plants are called proliferations. If a proliferation survives it will be an exact clone of the parent plant.

This experiment was begun in June of this year shortly after our peak bloom season here in Coastal South Carolina. The purpose of the experiment was to see if spent scapes (bloomed out and being aborted by the parent plant) contained dormant proliferation buds at the leaf bracts that could be reinvigorated and coaxed to grow.

This is by no means the easiest way to propagate daylilies, but it can be done. The project required daily attention and absolutely sanitary conditions (sterile is even better). Much like tissue culture, bacteria and mold can quickly cause death of the plantlets. The challenge is to maintain the growth of the plantlet until it is large enough to produce the small bulbous base from which the roots will grow.

To answer your questions: For the first five days the scapes were soaked in a container of water, changing it daily. Our water here has a very high chlorine content. Even so, when I try the experiment again (if time permits several weeks from now) I will be using an anti-microbial and a more controlled environment.

If the proliferation is growing outdoors on the live, healthy scape and the mother plant is supporting it, just leave it on the scape until it has roots and can grow independently. Nothing needs to be done until it is time to remove and plant it.

The following link will take you to another forum discussion where some of the participants also attempted the experiment. Some were successful--many were not. If you read both of these threads completely, you will get step by step instructions for the project as well ongoing progress reports and much feedback. There is also much discussion of how to handle natural proliferations and all aspects of growing Daylilies.
Garden Web Daylily Forum (http://forums3.gardenweb.com/forums/load/daylily/msg0610444014128.html?96)

Happy Gardening!

Shari

goldeneagle

09-25-2002, 08:58 PM

Shari - Just wanted to say THANK YOU - for all the information - and next year when my lilys come back I will most definitly be on the lookout for the scapes and working on the new babes - and the other forum site it was also very interesting -

Take Care - :)

Dazed_Lily

06-08-2003, 07:24 PM

I have kept this post from Shari in SC in mind for almost a year now as it was too late last year to pursue this. My Daylilies are gearing up and I want to be ready this time. I notice that Shari's pictures are no longer linked. I do know what a scape is, can't say I've dissected one, but would like to know where these 'eyes' are and how you'll know them when you see them. How do you keep from damaging them if they are inside the scape ? Hope Shari is still out there with the pix.
Thanks,Cathy

Rebecca

06-09-2003, 10:09 AM

Cathy,

I tried this last year but without any success! However, I also was able to collect 'natural' proliferations from a few of my own plants as well as some from bloomed out plants at work and they did great, for the most part.

One that hasn't doesn’t so well is a prolif from 'Joylene Nichol'. I ended up having to dig it up and put it into a pot; it seems to be doing better now. I got 7 big prolifs form those work plants. I think I lost one and almost lost another. Five are in the seedling bed and four of them are putting up scapes! Which sorta blows 'it takes two years of growing before they will flower' theory! Only real problem with them is I don't remember what the flowers looked like, if they are all the same or if some are different cultivars. They were all from a group labeled as 'Premium Picotee' and were stated as being a group of the nicest, most recent 'hybridizer plants' available on the market. Well it won't be long before I know!

Also, one of the statements Sheri made about the scape having to be carrying a pod before the buds would develop isn't necessarily so as all the prolifs I harvested last year came from plants that were not carrying pods. In fact those that were carrying pods didn't have prolifs at all! Of course climate might have something to do with is as well.

All in all, I don't force prolif production on scapes, I just let Nature take her course and harvest what she provides me with. Works much better for me and it's a lot less work!

Rebecca

Ann B.

06-09-2003, 02:16 PM

Hi, Cathy!

Shari tried to send her pictures to me via email, but for some reason, I was unable to open them.

I, for one, learned a lot from this post of Shari's. To tell you the truth, I didn't know much about daylilies at all except that I had been able to grow harvested seed while they were fresh without stratifying them.

I have learned that some daylilies go completely dormant in my climate, where others are more evergreen, still others are somewhere inbetween.

Now, I have learned from Rebecca that some are sterile, and there are two types that must be pollinated by like types.

Niether last year nor this year have any of the developed sizeable proliferations, so I have not tried Shari's experiment. Research on the net now provides just a little more informatin than a year ago. I have learned that some will produce a lot of proliferations one year, and the same plant will not produce any the next year.

I suspect that the spring droughts of this year and last year inhibited some of the production of proliferations. Most of mine are in full sun, and it does get HOT here fast. That may have some impact.

I have read where some people with very hot summers experience problems with wilting. Fortunately, I have never had that problem, but our summer heat is nearly always in the presence of high humidity and frequent thunderstorms from the Gulf as well as a cooling breeze.

I have also learned that there is a paste used by producers called "Lanolin-BAP-1 AA paste". that will increase the number and size of proliferations.

But the biggest lesson that I have learned is that now my daylilies are producing seeds like crazy. I have been spending a few minutes every day the last couple of weeks collecting pollen from some and hand pollinating others. What a difference, but then again, I have always been a seed NUT!

And WOW! Is it FUN!

Perhaps when Shari has time, she can update us with the conclusions from her experiements.

I know that I have learned an awful lot from all of you!

Dazed_Lily

06-14-2003, 08:22 AM

Shari from S.C. indicated : [Re her Grandad's advice in regards to sugar cane which she then applied to daylilies] 'He'd always point out the "eye's" at each joint and say "There's babies in there just waitin' to grow." '
Ann I know you tried to post her 're-sent' photos and it didn't work, but as I watch my 'native lilies' and others bloom, I'm anxious to know where on the scape are the eyes. The word 'joint' in Sharis' description makes me think they are where there are branches coming off the scape(basically in the vicinity of bracts-assuming there are bracts at these junctions). Is there a good description of how to locate these eyes ?

Rebecca

06-14-2003, 08:42 PM

Guys, I think I have something that might help explain a lot of these terms. Who's a thunk to go to the AHS's web site and seek answers from the experts! Me, dat's who! Here's the link

http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/ImageMap.html

Now, then, if you will click on each or any of the descriptive tags you'll be taken to another page that gives the definition as well as a photo illustrating it.

You might also want to check out the daylily dictionary for other daylily terms you are not failure with. The main page of the dictionary is a list of the words and each word is linked to a page giving not only the definition but photos or a graphic as well. There may also be links to other articles that cover the topic in more detail.

Hope this enlightens the whole subject for everyone.

Rebecca

Dazed_Lily

06-15-2003, 08:15 AM

Good Morning Rebecca-- Thank you. Whereabouts are the 'eyes' ?
Thanks !

Rebecca

06-15-2003, 06:21 PM

Dazed,

If you remove the bract, you will often find an 'eye' beneath it, especially of a branch didn't form there.

http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/bract.html

Check out this page .

Rebecca

Dazed_Lily

06-15-2003, 08:07 PM

Woo-Hoo ! Yes ! That was my guess ! Can't wait to give it a try !

DaylilyDawn

06-23-2003, 10:59 AM

Some daylilies are more prone to proliferate that others. It does not need a seed pod to do it. It is a desirable characteristic that most people who grow daylilies want in their line of plants. It is considered one way of increasing your stock of plants with out major investment in time or money.

sue salley

06-24-2003, 11:01 PM

I checked out my lilies the other day and there are babies in there! The lilies haven't bloomed yet but the little buds were there on the scapes. These ar 2 different double orange lilies 2 different people gave me. They have never bloomed before cause everytime the cows get out they go straight to this bed and eat them. So if the cows don't get out they should bloom this week. I can't wait.

Dazed_Lily

07-10-2003, 08:21 PM

Proliferations ! To tell you the truth I still didn't get it until I read back several posts and did a search on 'proliferations' instead of dwelling on bracts. I actually found a link with a picture:

http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_dictionary/proliferation.html

Now I know enough to know that I don't have any;)

For whatever reason prior to looking for this info. I had decided to inspect my daylilies for "eyes" (which I guess if you have them there's no doubt what they are--I don't so I don't know what they look like).

I did yank an agreeable drying scape or two out and wondered if the 'bump' at the base would do anything for me. Would it ?

Dazed_Lily

07-11-2003, 07:50 PM

Found me some proliferations(2) tonite on one of the daylilies I rescued from the demolition project. They are aways back from the flowers and buds and the telltale indicator is a long leaf(not those little shorties up closer to the flowering action) that when gently pulled back reveals a proliferation. So maybe this lily isn't a 'ditch lily' afterall--I didn't think they came bicolor with 3 petals solid and 3 petals with markings.
I might have another 'prolif' :cool: on one of my other daylilies but I'll have to watch it some more. Seems like the trick is to hope the flowering is done before the prolif starts to wither away. Maybe I'll figure out 'eyes' as I move forward.;)

Ann B.

07-11-2003, 09:13 PM

Cathy!

I did a google image search on just about everything that I could think of in search of a picture for you... Finally, I did a image search on 'root cuttings', and what do you know! A couple of Landspro images were listed! Now, I have to figure out how google found those!

Sometime, in the next few days, I will be moving some of my daylilies, and I will try my best to find one that has a fleshy root with a newly forming eye so that you can see what the term means.

For now, an explanation may help. Many perennials that multiply by roots such as daylily and hosta, will do so by forming a new eye, which simply put, is a new 'crown' forming and will produce a brand new daylily.

Sometimes, when you purchase a bareroot plant, they will tell you to plant the 'eye' or the 'crown' at a specific depth. This is important if the plant is to survive for that is where the new leaf/plant growth will emerge.

In the case of numerous perennials, as Rebecca has mentioned, a root will have formed a (sometimes very tiny) eye that is developing into a new plant. If you catch it just right, and take proper precautions, you can produce a new plant from this root.

With some, like the Stokes Aster, it is easier to propagate from root cuttings than others. It is one of the most fun and productive ways to reproduce plants that do not heavily produce seeds or propagate easily via stem cuttings.

More and more, I am trying to add to my list of plants that can be propagated by root cuttings. There doesn't seem to be a single source, but I can tell you that it is one way to get a LOT of new plants without sacrificing the health of the mother plant...

AND it is FUN!

So, until I can get those pictures, keep observing! You are learning leaps and bounds!

sue salley

07-12-2003, 10:05 PM

Ann, I have found hardy geraniums start easily by root cuttings. It is so much fun to see a new plant emerge in spring from a little sliver of root you potted in the fall. Comfrey also does well from root cuttings. If you try to dig up a patch you have to get every single piece of root or it keeps coming back. Yucca also does that.

Ann B.

07-14-2003, 04:59 PM

Hey, Sue!

What can I say!!! Root and leaf cuttings amaze me, and sometimes I think, WOW! That is the ultimate....

Then I see the bulbils form on the lilum scales and new leaves forming, and I think, Oh, WOW! That is the most fascinating site....

Today, I opened the ziplocs containing the daylily seeds that I harvested not long ago... This time, I added just a few crystals of Soil Moist because, well because, I add already mixed up some vermiculite, perlite and a smidge of soil moist, and it was already moist and ready to use....

This time, I did not put them directly under the fluorescent lights as described on the main Landspro Daylily from Seed page, simply because I am out of room with all the passifloras, amaryllis, etc., but I put them near enough to get some light.

One of the bags was put in another room with no light. And guess what, the ones in the room with light have lots of sprouts in each baggie! The ones in the room with very little light has no sprouts that I could find...

All of the ones that have sprouted were put in the 'baggies' on the evening of July 5th, 8 days ago. They had completely dried up and were shriveled. I fully expected to have to refrigerate them until they broke dormancy, but I didn't have to....

I have been told by daylily growers that some 'types' of daylilies will grow without cold dormancy and some will not. I guess these must be the type that do not require it.

I really don't know, but if someone wants to send me LOTS of seeds, I am willing to give it a try! LAS!!!!

Seriously, I have so much to learn, and I don't think anyone can generalize when it comes to the complicated world of plants.

It's all simply FUN and so very Rewarding, isn't it? Such a JOY to learn and TRY all sorts of new ideas....

Dazed_Lily

07-15-2003, 07:47 PM

I think that the 'eye' that Shari was referring to is what appears to be a 'nubbin' just under the bract(leaf). It is a swelled green area with a 'beige' pinpoint center; hence, the appearance of an 'eye'. So, now I've got:
8 pods a settin',
3 'prolifs' proliferatin'
and
an eye
on a
daylily ! :D Everyone...sing together now :D

AllGreenThumbs

07-16-2003, 05:39 AM

I noticed a few days ago on my way to visit my daughter, that at the entrance to a condo subdivision, that all their Ruby Stella Daylilies I had been admiring when they were in bloom, had all gone to seed mostly. I thought and thought about who I could ask permission to harvest some of the seeds. This wasn't on anyone's particular property, just all around the entrance. Finally, just ealy last evening, I decided to get some anyway..lol.
So, here I am out there with a baggie grabbing some seed pods and another lady walks up to me and introduces herself and asks me what I am doing..lol. I was giving her this big speal about being a landscaper/gardener and how me removing the seed pods were not hurting the plant at all and how it was actually making the plant look better, blah, blah, blah.. Well, she happened to LIVE in one of the condos and ended up grabbing some for herself too..lol. She said that the company that maintains the grounds for the condos, just cuts all of the flower scapes down and tosses them (imagine my horror!) so I intend to go back and get some more today..lol. Anyone want some? Email me privately!
Becki

sue salley

07-16-2003, 08:03 PM

Becki, I would love to have some ruby stellas but I don't know if they come true from seed. There was a post recently about stella seed and I think it was Rebecca said they do not come true.
Maybe we should check with her. Rebecca?
I went to a local fish restaurant today and at it's entrance was the most unusual lily I have ever seen. Some of the petals were pink and some yellow. I will have to go get some more fish soon...

Rebecca

07-16-2003, 08:45 PM

I heard my name being called and thought I'd better see what the ruccus was about!

Write this down, now!

Daylilies, being very highly bred to create the various colors and forms DO NOT COME TRUE FROM SEED. No "hybrid" plant will come true from seeds saved from such plants. There are a few exceptions, but daylilies are not one of them.

On the other hand, if you had pure species and set seeds on them using pollen from another plant of the exact same species, then these would grow true from seed.

Hybrids beget more hybrids. and the more complex the hybrid is the more variation will show up in any offspring produced by such hybrids.

'Stella D'Oro will produce mostly yellow offspring. Some will look similar to Stella, just as children in hyman families look similar to their parents, but they are not their parents. Offspring raised from these self pollinated seeds seldom bloom anything like the parent and rebloom is almost non-existant. Therefore, it is my humble opinion that sowing and growing seeds from any of the Stella hybrids is a waste of time.

I know y'all didn't want to hear that so I'll give you a little good news to go with the bad.

If you should happen across a public dispaly bed of mixed daylily cultivars and find pods on those plants then you stand a much better chance that something interesting would show up in the offspring. Bees have most likely done most, if not all, of the pollinating of these flowers so that means there's a better than average chance that 'different' pollen was introduced and a whole new set of genetic material was introduced.

I will, not doubt, have more seeds this fall than I will have room to grow (it's so hard to stop dabbing that pollen once you get started), I'm sure I will be able to share the extras with any of you willing to invest two years in growing them to blooming size. Let me know. I've made nearly 60 crosses to date, some, but not too many, have failed and there's still new plants in scape that haven't opened their first bloom yet!

As far as that goese, I've still got a hundred or so seedling from this year's crop that have to go somewhere and it won't be in any of my beds! They're all , more or less, lost tags, but you'd stand a better chance of getting something worthwhile from them than from seeds collected from and of the 'Stellas'.

Sorry to burst your bubble there , Becki, but it had to be done!

Rebecca

DaylilyDawn

07-16-2003, 08:51 PM

Rebecca, I would be glad to take the unwanted seedlings off your hand s for the price of postage if you are interested. If you are email me privately.

Ann B.

07-16-2003, 08:54 PM

Oh, GEE!

Save some for me! I have PLENTY of ROOM!

Your seedlings are so very pretty! I would make a special daylily garden and call it 'Rebecca's Garden'....

I'd be honored to have some of your seeds!!!!

How nice of you!

;)

AllGreenThumbs

07-18-2003, 01:01 PM

Rebecca,
You are right as usual! I don't know why I forgot all about them not coming true from seed if they've been self pollinated.... geesh!
Oh well, I am still gonna plant them and see what happens. NOT in MY garden, but will plant them somewhere else in this apartment complex where I can find room..lol.
Please put me on your list for any leftover seeds or seedlings! Will be happy to trade or buy them outright or at least do the postage thing!
Becki

ultracurious

07-13-2004, 12:20 PM

Originally posted by Shari of SC
Day 10 as well I am unable to view your picture attachments. How do you get the new "babies" to develop roots?

Dazed_Lily

07-13-2004, 01:26 PM

Welcome Ultracurious ! I'll let Ann verify but I think those pix are gone for good.
Here is a link however to another thread that I hope will answer your question. If not, let us know(scroll down particualrly to my message regarding what to do with the prolif):
http://www.landspro.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=1886&perpage=15&pagenumber=1

ultracurious

07-13-2004, 02:30 PM

Thanks for the reply. I had already visited this website, but have some
good scapes in process of trying to develop "babies". I know a fellow who
has tried it many times and says that he can get prolifs to develop, but
they won't ever defelop roots. He thinks something might have been left out
of the article.

Ann B.

07-13-2004, 04:54 PM

It's been a long time, but I believe that somewhere in this thread, someone, perhaps Shari, mentioned using rooting hormone.

I have a dead scape with a living proliferation on it. I potted the proliferation, but it also has not developed roots Then, again, it has only been a few days. I will most likely apply rooting hormone.

I have a huge proliferation on a scape that is still living. I will do as Rebecca, Shari and all have suggested and leave it on the living scape as long as I can. If it does not produce roots before the scape dies, I will remove it from the mother plant and use rooting hormone.

Unfortunately, I do not think it is a good idea to apply rooting hormone while it is still attached to the mother plant.

Will it work? I don't know. I am not as good with proliferations as some of the more experienced daylily growers.

ultracurious

07-13-2004, 05:05 PM

Thanks for the reply and the advise. I have been reading and some suggest that you cut the scape 2 to 3 inches below the prolif and put in a jar with the level of water even with the bottom of the prolif and maintain the water level constantly. They suggest that roots will form in a very few days.

Ann B.

07-13-2004, 05:10 PM

I've never tried it because I root very few things in water, but if you try it and it works, please let us know. Be sure to change the water frequently because you will have the cut edges which will begin to decay.

You may even want to cut off the decaying portion every couple of days to keep bacteria from forming in the water. Also, fresh water will contain more oxygen.

Thanks!

ultracurious

07-13-2004, 05:17 PM

Thanks a lot for your help. The article I referred to as "water method" is actually " STOP! Don't throw away those Daylily Scapes--there are babies in there!". That article did not mention rootone, but it sure sounds reasonable.

Ann B.

07-13-2004, 05:44 PM

Trader,

Shari mentioned it on July 10, 2002. Try to go back that far and see that post in this thread.

She stated that she used powdered rooting hormone, and her success rate was 28 out of 40, I think...

Dazed_Lily

07-13-2004, 06:18 PM

Leave it to me to throw in a red herring, but speaking of prolifs and hormones, note this writer's use of hormones to induce prolifs !( I ran across this while looking up info on pod harvest-saw before these posts today)

http://www.ca.uky.edu/HLA/Dunwell/DYLYPROP.html

which states:
"Applying Lanolin-BAP-1 AA paste to scapes to force proliferations or to get multiple proliferations is possible "(ultracurious: I see reference to Mr. Pickles again!)

Ann B.

07-13-2004, 07:10 PM

Thanks, Cathy!

I have read that article numerous times, and I want to try the 'ramet' thing.

Of course, I would never try it on an expensive daylily or one that I didn't have lots to spare.

It would be neat, though to see if it worked. I have propagated so my bulbs this way, and plants via root cuttings and leaf cuttings.

The only problem that I can see with it is the need for some sort of fungicide to prevent the 'cut' from decaying.

But first, let me get proficient at the proliferation thing. I am pleased to finally have a few that produce them.

BTW. the one with the large proliferation has a new scape forming on the same fan as the one that produced the huge proliferation. I will take a picture when it does bloom. It is an unknown for sure.

Whatever the reason, this one really wants to multiply. The scapes are quite thick and short.

We will see...